Sleep Reduction with ALCAR + l-theanine

Discussion in 'Anything and Everything about dietary supplements' started by virtualcyber, May 16, 2003.

  1. virtualcyber

    virtualcyber New Member

    Both ALCAR and l-theanine cannot be shipped to Cananda.
     
  2. AlexCA

    AlexCA New Member

    ####!!! any ideas??maybe some health food store here would have it under the counter??
     
  3. Smee

    Smee New Member

    Hi,

    [​IMG] This sounds too good to be true !!

    Any longish term side effects we should be aware of ?

    TIA
     
  4. virtualcyber

    virtualcyber New Member

    There has been nothing to indicate long-term ill effects. But this is not to say there isn't one, there has not been sufficient feedbac/study on it.

    The best it can be said is that there has not been any reported ill-effects in the studies I have seen, for the INDIVIDUAL ingredients (ALCAR or l-theanine) long term.

    There is a possibility that a prolonged use of ALCAR may deplete choline supply in the body. For this, you may want to take choline bitartrate (or other choline supply), at 1:1 ratio in weight.
     
  5. sean

    sean New Member

    I'm really really interested in trying this especially since next year is my senior year of high school and then I have college after that...so lots of time ahead of me when I'm not going to get the ideal 9 hours and 15 minutes of sleep (that's what I've read is best for my age anyway).

    I just asked my father about it briefly since he's involved in sleep medecine (though mostly sleep apnea since he specialized in pulmonalogy). Anyway, he quickly dismissed it as the same thing as using tryptophan to aid with sleep. He basically said that using this supplementation of this amino acid was dangerous because of the impurities that the supplement companies allowed in their products and that using tryptophan as a sleep aid, therefore, was discontinued.

    However, I was not entirely swayed by his arguments considering that all doctors seem to be inherently conservative and sometimes pessimisstic towards any treatments that are unorthodox. Also, he misspoke several times (not remembering whether the amino acid of which he was speaking was tryptophan or tyrosine...) which made me doubt the accuracy of his arguments. Plus, he thinks that ephedrine and even creatine are very dangerous.

    Anyway, I really can trust that when I buy l-theanine and alcar, that they are safe and without impurities, right? And, what was my father talking about???

    Thanks,

    Sean
     
  6. virtualcyber

    virtualcyber New Member

    Do search here on ALCAR and at www.AvantLabs.com's forum. Also, do a search on l-theanine at www.AvantLabs.com. Make sure you do a search from the beginning of AvantLabs, not just the last 30 days. You will find LOTS of reading material.

    In fact, you will see that there is simply too much material for me to summarize and post.

    Let us just say that l-tryptophan and l-tyrosine are not the same amino acid as ALCAR. ALCAR's effect on human body is very different from that of l-tryptophan or l-tyrosine.
     
  7. Smee

    Smee New Member

    Thanks Virtualcyber,

    Quick question, must it be specifically ALCAR or is L-Carnitine acceptable ?

    Edit : Scrap that, did the search on Avant. I guess the question is how much to up the dosage of L-Carnitine as opposed to 700mg of ALCAR.

    I've managed to track down L-Carnitine in 600mg caps which I thought might be a good start give the initial ~700mg recommendation. I guess 1200mg of L-Carnitine is probably too much.

    Back to the supp search I guess.

    Thanks.
     
  8. virtualcyber

    virtualcyber New Member

    smee: please ask any specific questions. I will be glad to answer them, if I can. In the previous post, I just didn't want to get too general, as it involves too much material.

    ----------------------

    As for your question on l-carnitine and ALCAR.

    I believe that at this point, consensus is that, EVEN though l-carnitine and acetyl-l-carnitine (ALCAR) do the same thing once inside the body, they are not absorbed at the same rate.

    From what I have read, ALCAR seems to be far better absorbed due to its acetylation.

    Also, it is cheaper.
     
  9. Smee

    Smee New Member

    Sorry, it ended up a bit of a ramble rather than a question after I deleted the actual question when I edited. [​IMG]

    I'm just going to order the ALCAR and L-theanine powders and give it a go.

    May have more specific Q's then, but the Avant discussion should probably take care of those too.

    Thanks for the heads up on this !
     
  10. virtualcyber

    virtualcyber New Member

    Smee:

    One thing I started finding out from reading other people's feedback is that there seems to be significant variance in DOSAGE.

    You are going to have to be somewhat patient in getting the right dosage and timing. Some take as little as 500 mg ALCAr to see the effect. Some take much, much more -- one friend I had felt nothing with 1 g/day and he took it for 1.5 week (this was rather unusual case, because every body else who tried it seemed to find SOME effect).
     
  11. Smee

    Smee New Member

    Thanks I saw that mentioned.

    I'm planning on starting at 500mg ALCAR and 600mg Theanine for a couple of days and will start playing from there.

    Regards,

    Justin.
     
  12. BIZ

    BIZ New Member

    Blade:
    What if someone bought it for you and mailed to you? Any regs against that in Norway? I am sure someone, even me, would be willing to do that for you and let you pay them back. You have done a lot of work here, so a little help sent your way is called for I think. Let me know...
    BIZ
     
  13. Blade

    Blade Super Moderator Staff Member

    Wow, didn't see this post until now...

    That would be great, but I actually think there are regulations against this, too. In fact, this is one of the reasons why we haven't started distributing Bryan's HSN line in Norway yet - first there was a problem with the specific sweetener being used, now there is a problem with an enzyme in the formulation. Sucks. [​IMG]

    I have my ways around it, though - and I'll soon be getting the chance to try this ALCAR+l-theanine combo for myself. :)
     
  14. proteus9

    proteus9 New Member

    My results so far (which isn't that long) [​IMG]

    Day 1 500mg ALCAR + 300 mg l-theanine
    Slept okay, not great, but felt better than usual
    during the day, but could be placebo effect
    Day 2 500 mg ALCAR + 400 mg l-theanine
    Slept badly, and feel tired today - think I waited
    too long to go to bed after I took supps.

    Starting with reduced doseage to see how it affects me.
    Trying 500 mg ALCAR + 500 mg l-theanine tonight
    Will post every 2 - 5 days on how I feel

    VC - reading avantlabs and saw several mentions of ala and choline with regards to ALCAR supplementation, can you tell me why I might need these (in english)? [​IMG]
     
  15. virtualcyber

    virtualcyber New Member

    proteus:

    1. ALA -- I think ALCAR administration was shown to slightly increases the rate at which cells produce harmful waste products (in mice experiments). ALA neutralizes it.

    2. choline -- Continuous consumption of ALCAR increases the rate at which ALCAR is eliminated from one's body, after few weeks. Choline helps one retain ALCAR.

    ------------------------------

    Also,

    choline + ALCAR = increased fat loss
    ALA = less oxidative damage from ALCAR.
     
  16. proteus9

    proteus9 New Member

    Update

    Days 3-5 500mg ALCAR + 500 mg l-theanine
    Really bizarre - I can't fall asleep to save my life.
    Take supps @ 8 pm - bed @ 11 - sleep @ 2 am
    but I'm not feeling tired the next day!!

    Sleep like crap (light sleep) when I do fall asleep.
    What's going on?? It's not a big deal now, but if I stop feeling as good the next day - life is gonna suck!

    VC - any ideas??
    Proteus

    (not taking stack tonight - going back to 1mg melatonin + diphenhydramine HCL stack - works for about 3 days, but only taking it tonight - will return to ALCAR + theanine tomorrow because I like how I feel)

    Will also add ala

    Thanks
    Proteus
     
  17. virtualcyber

    virtualcyber New Member

    proteus:

    (1) Some people are very sensitive to ALCAR.
    (2) It seems that ALCAR is building up inside your body, so greater effect as days go by.

    I bet that, even if you stop taking it for a day, you will still feel fine (until ALCAR leaks out of your system).

    ===================

    I can think of THREE ways to deal with it:

    (1) reduce the dosage
    (2) take ALCAR one to two hours earlier
    (3) or take the stack once every other day.

    I will probably try the option (2) first.
     
  18. sean

    sean New Member

    wait is the alcar from 1fast400 good? Where should I buy this stuff? I got l-theanine without the green tea extract at natural high inc. How do you make your own capsules...is it tedious?

    thanks,

    Sean
     
  19. proteus9

    proteus9 New Member

    Thanks VC

    Just to make sure I've got it

    500mg ALCAR @ 7pm
    600mg l-theanine @ 8pm
    sleep @ 11pm

    The ALCAR is for alertness and the l-theanine is for relaxation right?

    Proteus
     
  20. virtualcyber

    virtualcyber New Member

    proteus:

    Sounds good. Hopefully, you can fall asleep earlier.
    Also, you can experiment with taking l-theanine a bit later, closer to 9 p.m.

    ===============

    Sean:

    It sounds good. Also, ordering from 1fast400 should be fine. Making your caps is tedius.
     

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