How Many Sets

Discussion in 'Basic Training Principles and Methods' started by wrestlingmark, Jul 18, 2005.

  1. wrestlingmark

    wrestlingmark New Member

    OK, how many sets for the 15's, 10's , 5's and negatives? I read the FAQ's, i may be dumb, but i just need an answer! I've been doing this for my first cycle...well i did

    2 sets of 15 reps for 3 training sessions(15's)
    1 set of 15 reps for 3 training sessions(15's)

    2 sets of 10 reps for 5 training sessions(10's)
    1 set of 10 reps, 2 sets of 5 reps for 1 training session(10's)

    4 sets of 5 reps for 5 training sessions(5's)
    1 set of 5 reps, 1 set of 4, 3, 2, 1 rep for 1 training session(5's)

    Now I've read different things about volume on here this AND IM SO CONFUSED! PLZ HELP ME OUT! I know do what you can without getting injured or whatever...but besides that...AHHH!
    [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]
     
  2. Bryan's recommendation is

    2 sets for 15's

    2 sets for 1st week of 10's, 1 set for 2nd week

    2 sets for 1st week of 5's, 1 set for 2nd week

    Try that and follow this;

     
  3. wrestlingmark

    wrestlingmark New Member

    Are the decreasing sets due to the increase in load? Because you have 30 reps, then 20, 10, 10, then 5?

    I printed out a page that says to keep volume increasing or consistent but I cant find it to paste on here [​IMG] . But it says 1 set 15's= 15 reps, 2 sets of 10's= 20 reps, 4 sets of 5's= 20 reps. It also says on the last workout of 10's to do 1 set of 10 and 2 sets of 5's and on the last workout of the 5's to do 2 sets of 5's, then 4, 3, 2, 1.
    So, this is why I'm completely confused!
     
  4. Yes, as the load get's heavier the needed TUT is less crucial, still needed, but not as much.

    Working to a rep count is something many have done or are still doing, some call it clustering. It is a way of removing the decreasing TUT variable. so load (tension becomes the only variable as long as tempo is maintained consistently through the whole cycle.

    I used Bryan's recommendation simply because there are so many different methods and since you where asking I figured I would post would he recommends in the basic setup, but notice I posted his comments on changing the volume also.
     
  5. wrestlingmark

    wrestlingmark New Member

    What about negatives?
     
  6. Lance

    Lance New Member

    You can still mantain the a rep goal into your negatives. It may take A LOT of work, but you can do it. I'd rather do ~ 5 reps or so, and then metabolic work. The more reps though, the more stimulis ... as well as CNS fatigue.
     
  7. Bryan Haycock

    Bryan Haycock Administrator Staff Member

    If in doubt, just do the same number of "weekly" sets you've always done. Just split them up evenly over three workouts (i.e. over the course of one week).

    This way you already know you can handle to volume. Then if you find you need less or more, you can adjust the number of sets as needed.
     
  8. jl3goat

    jl3goat New Member

    I did 3 sets for some of my 15s with only 30 seconds or so between sets, so that I would at least get a good burn doing them on the last set, and enjoyed some pretty decent results this way. My maxes for 15s went up considerably between when I determined and the end of that 2-week cycle. As the weight increases, though, I drop to 1 or 2 sets. For 10's, I'm doing more warm-up exercises and fewer sets--2 for lighter weights and probably 1 or 2 as I get closer to the end. We'll see how this works.
     
  9. Rakki

    Rakki New Member

    Hey this sounds like fun!

    I'll ry it for my next cycle and let you guys know how it went :)
     
  10. Captain Crunch

    Captain Crunch New Member

    I do 2 sets for 15's
    I do 2 sets for 10's
    I do 3 sets for 5's
    Post 5's anything goes with negatives, drop sets, clusters(even in the 5's) etc...

    I forgot to mention that I do not Zig- Zag weights at all but continually increase from day 1 of the 15's through the last day of 5's. Truly progressive loading.
     
  11. Old and Grey

    Old and Grey Super Moderator Staff Member

    Doing a certain number of sets for all muscle groups makes no sense to me. Every muscle reacts differently to stimuli. You should do enough sets for each muscle to get a good pump. Doing less is ineffective and doing more is inefficient. A more interesting and controversial topic is whether the sets should be of the same exercise or different exercises. :confused:
     
  12. Captain Crunch

    Captain Crunch New Member

    O&G, I don't see anywhere that someone mentioned doing the same number of sets for each muscle group. The only thing mentioned was that they were doing the same number of sets per movement. That could mean that they are doing two chest movements and two back moves but only one arm movement per workout. (just an example).

    I totally agree with you that doing too little or too much is not good but everyone has their specific goals as well. Some are looking for a little more endurance where extra sets will pay off. Some are looking for a little more strength and some for size. I feel that although HST is set up for size of course that there is room to adjust these workouts to achieve the other benefits as well. Combined with good nutrition whether to gain, maintain or lose weight this program seems to fit for all.

    Mike
     
  13. Old and Grey

    Old and Grey Super Moderator Staff Member

    All excellent points Cap. [​IMG]
     
  14. faz

    faz Active Member

    wouldnt it be better to set a target ie,3 sets of 5, and if the load gets to much drop a set or 2. but if you feel ok go with it.
     
  15. Old and Grey

    Old and Grey Super Moderator Staff Member

    In my opinion, your target should be to get a pump. That may be one set or five sets depending on many factors that are uniquely individual. I also believe that experience can teach a person how to get the absolute most out of each and every set which means doing less sets to get the same benefit.
     
  16. O&G since you have said this twice now I am wondering why you feel it necessary?

    Since I am not one to try and pounce after a response let me explain why I feel it's not.

    A pump is more related to metabolic not tension specifically, so during a high rep set where you are aiming for metabolic increases I can see it, but for purely tension increases in hypertrophy I'm not so sure. Also even with metabolic signalling a burn set would IMO be more beneficial than going for a rock hard pump, even though I would bet you can get a burn going for a good pump, I know I can get a burn without one also.

    So shed some light on me please.
     
  17. Rakki

    Rakki New Member

    I get a pump on 1 set for most exercises, does taht mean it wouldn't do me any good to add another set for these?
     
  18. OneMoreRep

    OneMoreRep New Member

    I think what O&G is getting at is the quality factor... If one can get the same effect from lifting a load perfectly for 1 set, as apposed to rushing to meet a rep count for the first few sets... your wasting your time doing any more then one set.

    I think his idea shooting for a PUMP each and every exercise is just a way of maintaining the the load/volume ratio...

    could be wrong... i know you can get a *huge* pump with alot less then maximal weight... but assuming your using the same increasing load... i think it'd be an alright way to gauge your workouts.
     
  19. Rakki

    Rakki New Member

    Question:
    for multiple sets do you use the same poundage for the same # of reps?
    say for example..
    10 rep max for exercise A is 100lbs
    10 rep cycle would work from about 2 (sets) x 10(reps) x 70lbs till end of cycle where it follows that you do 2 x 10 x 100lbs. But what if for that second set at the end of the cycle you can't make a full 10 reps with 100lbs??
    that's why I've been sticking with 1 set per exercise but if there's a way to accomodate this I'd love to try it
    hope you understand the question this has been really bugging me for some time [​IMG]
     
  20. Old and Grey

    Old and Grey Super Moderator Staff Member

    Dan, I think you are trying to put an objective scientific definition on something that is subjective. My definition of a pump is certainly vastly different than, for instance, Vince Basisle or Mike Mentzer (RIP). Also, the amount of pump that you want to get shopuld be dependent on the frequency that you intend to use. A pump necessary for 12 full body workouts per week is different than the pump needed to grow on a fortnightly workout scheme.

    Rakki, just do as many reps of the second set as you can comfortably do, if you feel you need that second set.
     

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