Creatine and Whey questions!!!

S

_Simon_

Active Member
BWAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHA! i'm back!
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i know i was sorely missed, especially my endless questions ;)

ok, there's 2 things that i've always wondered about:

1. People say that mixing creatine in orange juice negates the effect of creatine.

2. People say that mixing whey protein in milk slows down the absorption of whey (some even say that the casein BREAKS DOWN the whey
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ARE any of these really true? i'm sick of rumors lol

ALSO lol: 3. Say i'm working out twice a week, will the creatine be efficiently absorbed if i take 3 or 4 servings per postworkout drink? (that is, take 3 or 4 servings after each workout to make up for the week rather than one serving each day?)

thanks in advance!
 
1. Not true. The idea is that acid breaks down creatine. Obviously if that were a concern... well, guess what the creatine encounters in your stomach?

2. Yes, it will slow down the absorption of whey to some extent. That isn't a problem though.

3. It won't make a whole lot of difference but you would be better off taking it each day. I find it easiest to put a serving in my tea. The creatine dissolves completely in hot beverages and leaves no taste.
 
hey thanks man, much appreciated!

hey i asked on another forum about the creatine and i got this answer: "To the first question, yes mixing creatine with a citric drink such as orange juice renders the creatine useless."

hmmm maybe once in the stomach the creatine goes to work quickly without the acid breaking it down? whereas if you mix it already it has time to break down into whatever it does???

hmmmmmmmmmmm? i don't know!
 
That doesn't really make sense if you think about it. How long will it be sitting in the orange juice before you drink it? What is the ph of orange juice? Like around 4, right? Stomach acid has a ph of 1 or 2, I believe. You mix the creatine into your orange juice and down it real quick, it's been in the orange juice for maybe a minute or two at most. It's now gone from being in an environment with a ph of 4 for a minute or so to being in an environment with a ph of 1 for at least a couple hours.

No, I don't think it's anything to worry about. No matter what you do, some of the creatine is going to be broken down into creatinine, and the amount that gets broken down in something only mildly acidic like orange juice, grapefruit juice, whatever, isn't going to compare to how much is broken down by your stomach acid. And... since all the studies were done on people who have stomachs, the results shown in those studies occured even after the creatine was subjected to being in stomach acid... so... not something I would worry about as long as you aren't premixing it hours in advance or anything.
If you did premix it in advance and did it in an acidic liquid, then I would be concerned. In fact, I would be concerned about premixing it in anything. The best thing to do would be to mix it and drink it immediately.

Now, if you are taking some other form of creatine besides mono, Creatine Ethyl Esther for example, then yeah - the acid environment it is in could be a concern. Studies show that CEE experiences a very significant breakdown in stomach acid compared to creatine monohydrate. Moral? Stick to the monohydrate.

I think this has been discussed here before, so if you want proof or something, I think a search would probably turn something up.

Personally... like I said, I prefer to mix it with hot beverages simply because then you don't have the sensation of drinking sand.
 
Oh, here, I just found this, which might help:




"Pharmacokinetics of the Dietary Supplement Creatine"
Adam M. Persky,1 Gayle A. Brazeau2 and Günther Hochhaus1
1 Department of Pharmaceutics, College of Pharmacy, University of Florida, Gainesville,
Florida, USA
2 Department of Pharmacy Practice and Pharmaceutics, State University of New York at
Buffalo, Amherst, New York, USA


"First, the rate of formation of the degradation product, creatinine, is increased in the presence of acid and therefore accelerated degradation is possible in the lower pH of the stomach. However, creatine degradation to creatinine occurs at its maximal rate at pH 3-4. The degradation half-lives for the conversion of creatine to creatinine at pH values 1.4, 3.7 and 6.8 are 55, 7.5 and 40.5 days, respectively. At these rates, less than 0.1g of a 5g dose would be lost in 1 hour. Therefore, the conversion to creatinine in the gastrointestinal tract is probably minimal regardless of transit time."


So... it looks like it could be even less of a concern than what I expressed above.
 
AHH i see, thanks totz, ur da man!!!

<div></div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">Personally... like I said, I prefer to mix it with hot beverages simply because then you don't have the sensation of drinking sand. </div>

soooooooo true......
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OK! so i shall now drink my creatine in hot OJ! mmmm hehe nah

many thanks
 
oh also, how much does casein affect whey's absorption??? i'm just thinkin, if taken postworkout, (ie milk and whey), will it delay recovery much? (because after a workout we need QUICK protein absorption) (even though it's not soooo so crucial)
 
<div>
(Totentanz @ Apr. 13 2008,10:37)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">Personally...  like I said, I prefer to mix it with hot beverages simply because then you don't have the sensation of drinking sand.</div>
I had such bad luck trying to get my creatine to dissolve that I finally gave up. I just pour the powder onto my tongue and quick drink something...
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(TunnelRat @ Apr. 15 2008,11:38)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE"><div>
(Totentanz @ Apr. 13 2008,10:37)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">Personally... like I said, I prefer to mix it with hot beverages simply because then you don't have the sensation of drinking sand.</div>
I had such bad luck trying to get my creatine to dissolve that I finally gave up. I just pour the powder onto my tongue and quick drink something...
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</div>
I might have to try that.
 
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(_Simon_ @ Apr. 14 2008,10:47)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">oh also, how much does casein affect ... it's not soooo so crucial)</div>
If you take a pre WO shake then the speed of your post WO shake doesnt matter. Even whey in water will take 2-3 hrs to completely digest, so even after your WO you are still getting &quot;fast&quot; protein... unless of course you are doing a marathon.

Research has shown that lowfat chocolate milk is very effective at recovery due to its carb/protein mix. If you want fast recovery look more at the carb/protein mix than speed of protein.

I have found that 3-4g of creatine monohydrate dissolves in room temp water with 5-10 minutes of moderate stirring. IIRC the disolution properties of water on creatine grow exponentially in magnitude with respect to the temperature of the water.
 
I have a pre workout shake of 1 scoop (~31g) of iso whey and 1 scoop of carbs (maltodex) on water 30 min prior to workout and a pos workout shake of 1 scoop iso whey, 1 scoop carb and 5g Mono Creatine on milk right after my workout. Does this sound good? Any suggestions?
I mix both shakes together so the pos workout shake with creatine and milk stays ready at room temperature for around 2 hours before I drink it would that be a problem?
 
<div></div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">I have found that 3-4g of creatine monohydrate dissolves in room temp water with 5-10 minutes of moderate stirring.</div>
Man, you could dissolve CEMENT in that much time! You're getting a workout just stirring!
 
Aaron, then I might have a problem, you see, I am in Rio de Janeiro, Brazil, it doesn't get much cooler then 30C.
 
Buy a little chiller pac and slip that along side it. it may survive without it but it also may taste like curdled garbage
 
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