Vicious (aka Jules), I know diet/caloric intake is the main difference between cutting and bulking. Could you please post your personal exercise selection, volume, and metabolic strain techniques that you include/exclude when cutting versus what you do when bulking? Also, what kind of diet/caloric intake do you prefer when you cut when using HST (low carb, CKD, isocaloric,etc)? Finally, thanks so much for all the information you have shared with us in your customizing thread.
Vicious, could you share your personal routine?
- Thread starter ttboyy2k
- Start date
I just use really high frequency to cut. That means 6-12x-a-week training with very, very low volume. (5-10 exercises, one set.) I'm not saying other people should do that, but for some wacky reason, it works great for me.
1) No stretches. No metabolic stress, except HIIT cardio.
2) I increase my flax and fish oil intake to fight off the inflammation.
3) I schedule most of my carb intake around my post-WO time. Most of non-WO carbs involves fruit and some grain, and so the citric acid mediate the insulin response and helps to aid in glycogen supercompensation. But I had no idea this was happening until a few weeks ago.
4) Daily, I probably eat 30-35% carbs with just one day where I carb load. I also increase my caloric intake by 50-100 calories every week or 2 weeks or so, mostly in protein and fat, and then a little in carbs if I'm feeling overly fatigued.
5) At least 2*BW protein (bulk or cut, protein is very high.)
In a sense, I'm still bulking, but "inefficiently." That is, I'm still trying to eat maitenance or a very mild surplus, but my carb intake significantly drops. I'm also more careful about my carb timing, especially since the frequency is so high.
Works great. When I'm around 12%, I usually expect a 0.75-1.25lbs fat loss week to week doing this, with nominal muscle loss. (But I haven't tried dipping under 8%, which I assume would require a CKD-ish program.)
Again, I'm not saying that this is what other people should do. But, because I found that high frequency just works beautifully for me (and I can handle it), I just do it for bulking and cutting. Then, having established my protein levels, I just mess around with the carbrotein ratio to determine whether I'm bulking or cutting.
cheers,
Jules
1) No stretches. No metabolic stress, except HIIT cardio.
2) I increase my flax and fish oil intake to fight off the inflammation.
3) I schedule most of my carb intake around my post-WO time. Most of non-WO carbs involves fruit and some grain, and so the citric acid mediate the insulin response and helps to aid in glycogen supercompensation. But I had no idea this was happening until a few weeks ago.
4) Daily, I probably eat 30-35% carbs with just one day where I carb load. I also increase my caloric intake by 50-100 calories every week or 2 weeks or so, mostly in protein and fat, and then a little in carbs if I'm feeling overly fatigued.
5) At least 2*BW protein (bulk or cut, protein is very high.)
In a sense, I'm still bulking, but "inefficiently." That is, I'm still trying to eat maitenance or a very mild surplus, but my carb intake significantly drops. I'm also more careful about my carb timing, especially since the frequency is so high.
Works great. When I'm around 12%, I usually expect a 0.75-1.25lbs fat loss week to week doing this, with nominal muscle loss. (But I haven't tried dipping under 8%, which I assume would require a CKD-ish program.)
Again, I'm not saying that this is what other people should do. But, because I found that high frequency just works beautifully for me (and I can handle it), I just do it for bulking and cutting. Then, having established my protein levels, I just mess around with the carb
rotein ratio to determine whether I'm bulking or cutting. cheers,
Jules
Do you have the link where you learned about the citric acid content from fruit mediating the insulin response from carbs and aidding in glycogen supercompensation? I've only heard about acetic acid found in vinegar is good for that. At least in rats it seems to work. Also, did you happen to see the study about fenugreek extract increasing muscle glycogen repletion by 63%. Supposedly, it has a very large impact in the short term (4-6 hours) while refeeding/carb loading. Lyle McDonald, talks about it at his web site in his bodyrecomposition.com forums.
savagebeast
New Member
Here is a study about glycogen repletion in rats that compares acetic acid and citric acid: Effect of acetate on glycogen replenishment in liver and skeletal muscles after exhaustive swimming in rats
If you click on the thing that says "PDF [113 KB]" you can view the whole study.
If you click on the thing that says "PDF [113 KB]" you can view the whole study.
I
imported_gazz
Guest
Jules
You're training 6-12 times per week, presumably 6 days once or twice a day. Could I ask you:
1.Do you still adhere to the basic HST principles of working within 2 week blocks (15's, 10's etc).
2.Are alll workouts full body or would you split am/pm.
3. If so how many exercises do you rotate from workout to workout for each bodypart (eg. chest w/o 1 dips,w/o 2 Bench etc?)
4. Also what sort of percentage of your top weight within each 2 week block do you drop down to at the beginning of that block eg top weight 15 reps with 100 in a given exercise, what weight would you start with.
Many thanks for the insight.
All the best
Gazz
You're training 6-12 times per week, presumably 6 days once or twice a day. Could I ask you:
1.Do you still adhere to the basic HST principles of working within 2 week blocks (15's, 10's etc).
2.Are alll workouts full body or would you split am/pm.
3. If so how many exercises do you rotate from workout to workout for each bodypart (eg. chest w/o 1 dips,w/o 2 Bench etc?)
4. Also what sort of percentage of your top weight within each 2 week block do you drop down to at the beginning of that block eg top weight 15 reps with 100 in a given exercise, what weight would you start with.
Many thanks for the insight.
All the best
Gazz
1) Yup. That means deads 6-12x-a-week.
2) Full body, but I often cluster deads.
3) It's a very minimal workout. (You really can't do a whole lot with extremely high frequency.) One set per exercise. Maybe 6 compound movements. A few isolation movements here and there. Negatives for 4 weeks, so that I have access to extremely heavy loads. Usually HIIT cardio on a Versaclimber after each workout session. On a good day, it's a 30-45 minute workout, no more.
4) Really, some of it is instinct. At 12x-a-week (which is difficult), you downshift at least one normal load increment from your true max, and try to make it up during the post-5s.
I'm not necessarily recommending this to anybody. Basically, I treat cutting as a form of "lazy bulking." I take care of the pre/post-WO nutritional situation as if I were bulking, but the rest of the day, I keep my carb intake rather low and meat sources moderate. The total caloric intake is still maintenance or just above, but I lose fat anyway. I actually don't know if this will work for anybody else, but it pretty much means I don't have to worry about losing a lot of muscle while cutting and I don't have to keto.
I pay more attention on taking flax, fish, and borage oil in order to keep inflammation and cortisol levels down.
cheers,
Jules
2) Full body, but I often cluster deads.
3) It's a very minimal workout. (You really can't do a whole lot with extremely high frequency.) One set per exercise. Maybe 6 compound movements. A few isolation movements here and there. Negatives for 4 weeks, so that I have access to extremely heavy loads. Usually HIIT cardio on a Versaclimber after each workout session. On a good day, it's a 30-45 minute workout, no more.
4) Really, some of it is instinct. At 12x-a-week (which is difficult), you downshift at least one normal load increment from your true max, and try to make it up during the post-5s.
I'm not necessarily recommending this to anybody. Basically, I treat cutting as a form of "lazy bulking." I take care of the pre/post-WO nutritional situation as if I were bulking, but the rest of the day, I keep my carb intake rather low and meat sources moderate. The total caloric intake is still maintenance or just above, but I lose fat anyway. I actually don't know if this will work for anybody else, but it pretty much means I don't have to worry about losing a lot of muscle while cutting and I don't have to keto.
I pay more attention on taking flax, fish, and borage oil in order to keep inflammation and cortisol levels down.
cheers,
Jules
savagebeast
New Member
[b said:
Does the same go for squats?
Without any clue really, I take a dose of 6g of flax oil and 6g of fish oil daily.
This is just something I "decided" I'd do. What is in actuality, a reasonable intake amount? For let's say, a 3-6 times a week bulking routine. Does it differ whilst you're cutting? Do you sometimes want to strangle people constantly swarming you with questions?
Actually, this question is open to anyone who has a clue.
This is just something I "decided" I'd do. What is in actuality, a reasonable intake amount? For let's say, a 3-6 times a week bulking routine. Does it differ whilst you're cutting? Do you sometimes want to strangle people constantly swarming you with questions?
Actually, this question is open to anyone who has a clue.
[b said:
Not so much that, but I often find himself giving the same two answers. "Eat" and "Eat more."
[b said:
Really, I just take the necessary amount to keep my joints happy and skin supple. Which means I also take some evening primrose oil to get a 2-3:1 EPA/GLA ratio with the (pharma-grade) fish oil. Works like a charm. I can't take a lot of fish oil without getting gastric distress.
[b said:
Yes, but understand that this isn't a bulking cycle. During a bulking cycle, I would be adding a lot of stretch point movements, metabolic work sets, loaded stretches, etc. The only thing I increase during the cycle is cardio, which also contributes metabolic stress to my legs, arms and back.
cheers,
Jules
[b said:
I usually do the core routine for every session. So, the bodyparts themselves are hit 6-12x-a-week. Stretch point and other good stuff aren't done every session, but that is more an issue of time constraints in a busy gym than anything else.
Now, you could do a split, say bent-over rows during one session and cable rows for another. But the idea is to hit everything really, really frequently. And that can be taxing.
cheers,
Jules