Stupid question on sets

R

Razien99

New Member
Ok im still reasonably new to all this & trying to understand what does what.

So ive read on this site and here:
http://bjsportmed.com/cgi/content/full/36/5/319

That multiple sets doesnt result in any significant strength increases compared to doing just 1...but i keep seeing people refer to doing 5 sets of 5 reps. So what am i missing..
 
I only do one set.

This sight is primarily concerned with size, not strength -although most people want both- and I guess a lot of people feel they benefit from the added time under tension and metabolic work that multiple sets provide. Perhaps they just feel one set, not to failure is too easy!
 
Carpinelli is a big HIT lover and usually talks endlessly about doing a single set per exercise.

Just how Dorian Yates performed HIT, sure he performed one work set on barbell rows, but he also perfomed 10 other back exercises in the same session...

Other research collates it into volume per session, rather than per exercise.

If we look at it in terms of powerlifting, I cant say I have seen a top level powerlifter who only perfoms one set of anything.
 
Ok cheers guys that makes more sense to me. That website looks very handy aswell for gettin down a basic understanding of how things work so ima be reading that for a whillllee.
 
<div>
(Aaron_F @ Mar. 13 2006,21:51)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">
If we look at it in terms of powerlifting, I cant say I have seen a top level powerlifter who only perfoms one set of anything.</div>

Yeah, but how many top level powerlifters aren't juicing?
 
No hes not saying that. Perhaps hes saying that powerlifters are able to train so frequently, with such high volume partly because their juicing and for a non-juicing non-professional athlete one set may provide a viable and efficient alternative.
 
<div>
(style @ Mar. 17 2006,14:17)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">No hes not saying that. Perhaps hes saying that powerlifters are able to train so frequently, with such high volume partly because their juicing</div>
except with the comment

&quot;Yeah, but how many top level powerlifters aren't juicing? &quot;

seems to say that there are more top level powerlifters using than who are not.  

If hes got some evidence, i would be interested, as would WADA and the IPF doping committee.  (or was he thinking that all top lifters are in the American untested federations and are actually using? - just becuase they compete in non-tested federations does not mean they use)

<div></div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">and for a non-juicing non-professional athlete one set may provide a viable and efficient alternative.</div>

Except in the case of powerlifting, they are not professionals, and I dunno if I would call them athletes.  
Non professional athletes can be working out at a much higher volume than any powerlifter would ever dream of (see most endurance geeks)

One set is a viable alternative to somebody who is competing in another sport, but using weight training as an aid to that.  especially in novices adn intermediates.  

But to somebody whos sport is the lifting, they will spend a lot more time on it, doesnt mean they are doing massive quantites of sets to failure, but they are not doing one set for anything or at least not very often (within this example it volume (ie sets) also ties into frequency and intensity)
 
The only evidence I have is personal experience with olympic lifters, powerlifters and bodybuilders. High school and college football is practically synonymous with juice (there is a 17 year old here front squatting 450). I know competitive lifters, but no, that doesn't mean they are all juicing. But it is naive to think the top guys are not juicing.

The olympics test also, was Ben Johnson the only using or just the only one who got caught and hung out to dry?

And no I was not implying you need to be on juice to do more than one set of a lift. What I meant was that guys who train at a very high volume and frequency are probably juicing. And, I was not making a judgment of right or wrong about using juice either.
 
<div>
(liegelord @ Mar. 17 2006,18:22)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">The only evidence I have is personal experience with olympic lifters, powerlifters and bodybuilders. High school and college football is practically synonymous with juice (there is a 17 year old here front squatting 450). I know competitive lifters, but no, that doesn't mean they are all juicing.</div>
So your taking your personal experience at high school and comparing it to powerlifting. What money can somebody make by getting better at football, and what can they gain from being a powerlifter?.

But I also know people who have walked into the gym and benched 440+ with no training.

Some people are just strong.

There are some lifters who have made WPO level in the US with no drug use. They use now, but thats a differnet story.

<div></div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">But it is naive to think the top guys are not juicing.</div>

its also niave to assume that they all are using.

<div></div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">The olympics test also, was Ben Johnson the only using or just the only one who got caught and hung out to dry?</div>

SO if one person uses, all use? Of course not.

<div></div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">And no I was not implying you need to be on juice to do more than one set of a lift. What I meant was that guys who train at a very high volume and frequency are probably juicing.</div>

Great, im probably juicing.
wink.gif
(is 3x weekly, ~10work sets per day on a high volume week 'high volume and frequency'?.. thats just bench.) but I have been told that before.

<div></div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE"> And, I was not making a judgment of right or wrong about using juice either.</div>Didn't say you were

Im also not saying that people are not juicing. But assumption is the mother of all f**kups.
 
I never wrote that all the top guys juice, it's a common part of the sport though. Do you really think Ben Johnson is the only guy in the olympics who used steroids? That does not mean I think every single competitor is juicing though.

Maybe we can agree steroids are a very popular and prevalent part of training, especially at the top level and steroids definitely affect the methods one can train with, i.e., higher frequency and higher volume.

I remember a story John Grimek told about a guy in the 1940's who almost outlifted him. With no training whatsoever he pressed almost 400 pounds, most certainly without steroids. So I agree, some guys are strong without lifting weights. They are the exceptions though, not the rule.
 
Aaron, a 440 lb. bench with no training? That sounds hard to believe. Who was this person, did they have great mechanics for the lift along with genetics? Are you sure they never did anything before?

How much are they pushing now, any idea?

That's twice as much as I lifted when I started.
 
I dont know if you have met many polynesians, but I have met some that are over 300lbs without training. And over 330 with training...

Excellent genetics
 
<div>
(liegelord @ Mar. 18 2006,16:48)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">I remember a story John Grimek told about a guy in the 1940's who almost outlifted him. With no training whatsoever he pressed almost 400 pounds, most certainly without steroids. So I agree, some guys are strong without lifting weights. They are the exceptions though, not the rule.</div>
Except top powerlifters are the exceptions, they are not the rule.

Otherwise every lifter would be doing it
 
<div>
(Aaron_F @ Mar. 17 2006,03:46)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">Great, im probably juicing.  
wink.gif
  (is 3x weekly, ~10work sets per day on a high volume week 'high volume and frequency'?..  thats just bench.) but I have been told that before.</div>
Aaron,

How is this working for you.

This forum calls me crazy for doing 4 work sets 3 times a week 12 total a week.

Obviously you are an expert so I would love to see how this is working for you!

Thanks
 
Powerlifters often use high volume. I am doing 5-8 sets on korte's program. But the loads are light (around 60% of 1 rm) and only three exercises/workout. I have heard of guys doing westside who spend over 10 hours/week lifting! Alot depends on conditioning, and limiting frequency and/or absolute load when doing high volume.
 
<div>
(Joe.Muscle @ Feb. 19 2007,15:42)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">Aaron,

How is this working for you.

This forum calls me crazy for doing 4 work sets 3 times a week 12 total a week.

Obviously you are an expert so I would love to see how this is working for you!

Thanks</div>
about that
smile.gif
have taken some time off heavy and finally getting back into it

as a part of a periodized program volume is great fun.

Do a search for sheiko or Smolov

A variety of russian conjugate programs, where you have periods of extreme frequency and volume combined with periods of increased intensity, and unloading from volume/frequency.

5x weekly bench movemnets

3-4x weekly squatting
 
<div>
(scientific muscle @ Feb. 19 2007,16:06)</div><div id="QUOTEHEAD">QUOTE</div><div id="QUOTE">Powerlifters often use high volume. I am doing 5-8 sets on korte's program. But the loads are light (around 60% of 1 rm) and only three exercises/workout. I have heard of guys doing westside who spend over 10 hours/week lifting! Alot depends on conditioning, and limiting frequency and/or absolute load when doing high volume.</div>
its not something you want to jump into with no building of volume or anything, nor is it all completely required. But once you get to the point of diminishing returns, you start requiring MORE to do something.

And some of the russian style programs can take 1.5-2.5 hours per day, 6-7 days per week.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top