How far do you go down on SL Dead Lift?

cwc73

New Member
I have heard people say stop on the toes, go past the toes (both require the block), and I have heard some say to go mid-shin.

The mid shin is the only one I have heard a reason for. Whoever said that if you go past mid shin you are just using your back.

So what is it guys? And Gals?
 
If i want to keep good posture with straight back i will not go below 90 degrees between legs and back. With that angle bar is somewhere in the mid-shin.
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] (Tcup @ Feb. 28 2005,2:09)]If i want to keep good posture with straight back i will not go below 90 degrees between legs and back. With that angle bar is somewhere in the mid-shin.
I agree with this. Much below that level and you'll be recruiting the back into the movement. That said, you want to go far enough that you feel a good stretch in the hammy and allow them to do the work getting the weight back up.
 
I've got another question. I'm in the AFROTC, and I go to Field Training next summer. We'll be constantly at the position of attention, so I was wondering if going down below 90 degrees would strengthen my lower back. Would it be advantagous to go lower in this case, or will it be detrimental to my posture?

Thanks for the replies.
 
:D Hi again, cwc!

There are actually several ways to do this exercise. The form described above is the safest for the lower back and keeps the weight on the hamstrings. So for growing or strengthening the hammies and for staying away from old back injuries, this is the preferred form.

However, what you ask is certainly possible, especially for a young healthy trainee with no history of back pain. This is a much higher risk exercise in terms on injury however.

It makes more sense for most trainees to separate the two motions, to do the Stiff LDL with a straight back for hamstrings, and do a separate motion such as good mornings, back hyper extensions or (my favorite) reverse hyper extensions over an exercise ball.

There are folks who would suggest that if you need your body to be strong through a range of motion, you need to move it through that range of motion. Intuitively, this makes sense. So, it is a question of weighing risks vs. benefit. Does the potential benefit from doing SLDL with flexion and extension in the lower back outweigh the risk of injury to lower back musculature?

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Really didn't answer your question I guess... I'll be interested to hear what others say...

Happy hypertrophy!
Kate
 
I use small size plates (because the big ones hit the floor too early) and just stand on the floor. Too be honest I feel the muscles in my lower back more than in hamys (this is because i havnt done this exercise for months), but im not too fussed because its good for your lower back.

My mate with a bad back just does the hamstring machine.

All my pals that enter competitions stand on a box so they can go miles down.

Just depends how you feel (also if u havnt been training that long ud be stupid to stand on a box, because your ligaments wont be used to it, itd be like tryn to do the splits when uv never done gymnastics, ie risky)
 
ian, if you're feeling it in your lower back, your form isn't great...and you're using too much weight, most likely.
 
I thought that, but I cant c what im doin wrong. + i know a good few people that have said thatthey can never see how SLDL work and they 2 feel it more on the back.

My backs straight?? I luk up, (like in squats), I just thought it was prob because i havnt done SLDL for years (I used do do the machine 4 hams) and my back was getn used to the stretch.

Any ideas then??
 
a few things to check:

1. do you keep a very slight bend in your knees? You should...
2. bring the weight far enough down that you feel a stretch in the hammies...then focus on coming back up using your legs...not your arms and/or back.
3. Use straps to hold the bar...it allows you to let the weight hang more than otherwise, in my opinion...and allows one to focus more on the legs doing the work.
 
I have been doing Partial SLDLs and they seem to burn my hammies nicely. Conversely, my training partner was feeling it more in his back, so we tried to see what was happening differently with our form.

Firstly, he is quite inflexible in his hamstrings and archilles tendons. In my SLDL, I was able to go below my kneecaps and he was trying to mimic that same depth. However the bar would travel away from his legs and he would flex from the waist. I was focussing on him keeping a proper concave in his lower back and wasn't paying attention to this, but when I noticed this it made sense that he was feeling it more as a back exercise than in his legs.

Then I noticed the bar would travel out from his legs at the point where his butt stopped moving backwards.

From what I've read, and how I feel is 'right', you start with the bar next to your thighs and then rock back on the heels, sticking your butt out as if trying to knock over a small child. As soon as your butt stops moving laterally, you should stop descending, as from this point you start flexing from the waist and changing the muscle groups affected. I believe there are more beneficial and safer exercises for the back eg. hyper-extension. All the while the bar should be following your thighs and should not move too far away from your legs.

Now my partner stops descending at just above his kneecap but feels the weight constantly in his hamstrings and can start progressively loading the bar more agressively than before. He still needs to work on stretching- but don't we all.

Again, the key was to keep the bar grazing the front of the legs and stopping the descent when your butt stops moving backwards.
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] ]My backs straight?? I luk up, (like in squats)

Ian, try looking *out* (as in looking at a distant object on the horizon). If you look *up*, you'll risk hyperextending your back (not to mention putting excess strain on your neck). You should feel SLDLs in your hammies, not your lower back.
 
When I do SLDLs, I bend until my torso is about parallel to the floor, keeping my back perfectly straight. The bar goes down to about mid-shin level.

I think you're gonna feel this one in your back even if your form is perfect. In fact, this movement has strengthened my own back from the traps on down. However, your lower back should not be the prime mover here! You're almost guaranteed to injure yourself if you use your lower back as the prime mover.

Also, don't do these heavy until you've warmed up thoroughly. I always start with 20 reps of the bar alone just to get "oiled up," so to speak.
 
I don't see how a SLDL can effectively work the hammy's without having some effect on the lower back, particularly at a higher weight. Just like a Bent Over Row will be felt in the lower back to the slightest degree. Holding your back straight req's a static contraction by the spinus erectus right?

Same rule as all exercises: keep your form good, don't try and be superman :)
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] (Jester @ Mar. 04 2005,5:58)]Holding your back straight req's a static contraction by the spinus erectus right?
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Yep!

If you're doing them for hammies, the low back should be locked tight, and all the motion should happen at the hips. Fatigue as a result of this isometric contraction is pretty normal, although my back is more apt to complain from the higher rep work.
 
I don't see how a SLDL can effectively work the hammy's without having some effect on the lower back, particularly at a higher weight.

Exactly! Actually, it's a superb movement for strengthening the lower back, spinal erectors...hell, the entire back of your body. One of my favorite compound movements.
 
hmm.. I'd love to get a detailed version on normal deadlifts, just in case I'm doing it wrong.. and to compare it with stiff legged deadlift, which I've never done.

S.
 
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