Question about no SD when cutting

[Digitalis]

Could someone explain to me why a SD is not recommended on a cutting cycle?

How could the submax weights be effective without an SD? SD is integral to an HST program. Maybe the submax weights are enough to maintain muscle mass?

lylemcd has advised keeping things heavy (4-8 reps) during a cutting cycle. This approach makes more sense to me, but I'd like to hear from this forum first.

Thanks,
Jay

 

[imported_dkm1987]

Exactly, Digitalis

During a cut it is more important to worry about LBM loss than gain, since a big deficit in calories isn't going to get you growing anyway. One way to help improve the LBM loss is to apply a load to tissue, now if SD'ing and cutting calories you are more than likely to lose more LBM than no SD and cutting calories.

Make sense.

IMHO, you could get a way with staying at one constant load during a cut, but progressivley loading should still provide a better result.

 

[ttboyy2k]

Quote[/b] (dkm1987 @ June 20 2005,1:06)]Exactly, Digitalis
During a cut it is more important to worry about LBM loss than gain, since a big deficit in calories isn't going to get you growing anyway. One way to help improve the LBM loss is to apply a load to tissue, now if SD'ing and cutting calories you are more than likely to lose more LBM than no SD and cutting calories.
Make sense.
IMHO, you could get a way with staying at one constant load during a cut, but progressivley loading should still provide a better result.

So if you are cutting and using proggressive overload and choose not to sd, what should you do once you reach your load ceiling's (negative maxes etc.) for each exercise? Should you start back over with 10 rm loads and progress forward again or should u use what Lyle McDonald says and do a week or two of deloading weights, less weekly volume but keep intensity high? Also, if a person with a 10-15% starting body fat level is using a PSMF, VLCD or some sort of CKD diet to get to extreme low body fat levels quickly, wouldn't it be better to eat at maintenance calorie levels for two weeks after every four weeks or so of training? Given this would help to bring up leptin/metabolism and thyroid levels that tend to drop quick from extreme dieting. If a person ate maintenance calorie levels for 2 weeks wouldn't this be the ideal time to SD instead of deloading since lbm levels should stabilize when food is plentyiful?

 

[imported_dkm1987]

Quote[/b] (ttboyy2k @ June 20 2005,12:49)]So if you are cutting and using proggressive overload and choose not to sd, what should you do once you reach your load ceiling's (negative maxes etc.) for each exercise?
Should you start back over with 10 rm loads and progress forward again or should u use what Lyle McDonald says and do a week or two of deloading weights, less weekly volume but keep intensity high?
Also, if a person with a 10-15% starting body fat level is using a PSMF, VLCD or some sort of CKD diet to get to extreme low body fat levels quickly, wouldn't it be better to eat at maintenance calorie levels for two weeks after every four weeks or so of training? Given this would help to bring up leptin/metabolism and thyroid levels that tend to drop quick from extreme dieting.
If a person ate maintenance calorie levels for 2 weeks wouldn't this be the ideal time to SD instead of deloading since lbm levels should stabilize when food is plentyiful?

I would just continue with the highest RMs (5's or whatever)

I definately agree with Lyle on reducing the volume, you are already at a deficit why compound it with added energy expediture. I personally don't see where reducing the load would be more beneficial but maybe Lyle has something in mind there (do you recall why he mentions this). I would also add possibly reducing the frequency to 2X week, use the other time at hand to increase cardio. I also do not see any advantage to increasing intensity, unless it is a matter of carb depletion.

I would agree to the re-feeding and to the using an SD if you are eating at maintenance.

 

[ttboyy2k]

Bryan mentioned in the FAQ that if you are using AAS or prohormones for long cycles (think 10-16 weeks in duration) there is no need for an sd and you could skip the 15's if your joints are in ok health. Also, he said you could repeat the same load for 3-4 workouts since RBE isn't as big of an issue while on the juice. Well if you don't sd., what do you do once you reach your maxes and start PCT recovery. Do you just immediately start back over into the 15's? If you are bulking and starting PCT would'nt you want the load to keep increasing or remain constant for as long as possible until normal test levels are restored? I know the logical thing would be just to reduce volume (sets/cluster reps) when you come off but keep load the same or increasing but one of the problems that arrises when you train heavy for so long is the joints can't take it anymore. Would the added metabolic work be enough to keep the joints lubed up until test levels restore?

 

[imported_dkm1987]

Quote[/b] (ttboyy2k @ June 20 2005,1:48)]Do you just immediately start back over into the 15's?

I'll leave that to someone who has experience w/AAS

 

[noah]

I would think a SD period should be part of a 'cutting cycle', meaning you SD at the end to reset your muscles.  But it would be a bad idea to combine the SD with a calorie deficit; this I believe is the only sense in which the SD is not 'recommended'.  So cut for awhile, then SD while back on maintenance or slightly lower (which has added benefit of helping reset metabolism while muscles are resting), then resume cutting again with new HST cycle (or mass gain cycle or whatever).
At least this is what makes sense to me.  If this is a bad idea, perhaps someone will let me know...